How to be an effective caregiver for your loved one – and for yourself

The following transcript was generated electronically. Please let us know if you see any transcribing errors and we’ll get them corrected immediately. 

Bruce Kassover: Welcome to Life Without Leaks, a podcast by the National Association for Continence. NAFC is America’s leading advocate for people with bladder and bowel conditions, with resources, connections to doctors, and a welcoming community of patients, physicians, and caregivers. All available at nafc.org. 

Welcome back to another episode of Life Without Leaks. I’m your host, Bruce Kassover, and joining us today is Sarah Jenkins, the executive Director for the National Association for Continence. Welcome, Sarah.

Sarah Jenkins: Thanks, Bruce. I’m so happy to be here. 

Bruce Kassover: Yeah, I’m excited too because today our guest is Michelle Mongillo, and she has more than 30 years of experience working in hospitals, rehab centers, nursing homes, patient homes, and you know, now she’s with First Quality where she provides clinical expertise for new product service development, really while continuing a lifelong passion for educating caregivers.

If you’re not familiar, First Quality is a company that’s been around for 35 years. It’s a family owned company and they are a manufacturer of products for, among other things, for incontinence, for adult incontinence, but a whole range of products. And they really are a leader in healthcare and retail across North America. And you know, we’re really excited to, to hear what Michelle has, especially because she is the author of a new book that I think that a lot of our listeners and especially the caregivers who are listening are going to get a lot out of so, welcome Michelle. Thank you for joining us today. 

Michelle Mongillo: Thank you for having me, Bruce. And “Hi,” Sarah! 

Sarah Jenkins: Hi! Great to see you… 

Michelle Mongillo: You, too.

Bruce Kassover: So now before we start talking about this book, I just went through a whole list of experience and qualifications that is really impressive. Maybe you want to give us a quick summary of how you got to be here today with all of that background. So, so how did you become such an expert on incontinence, caregiving, and you know, the treatment of these sorts of conditions? 

Michelle Mongillo: Well, thank you Bruce, and thank you for that nice introduction. You know, I, I’ve been with First Quality for 20 years and throughout that 20 years I just have developed this passion for incontinence and for helping people. And, you know, I’m fortunate that I work for a company that really supports education and partnerships like NAFC and that they believe that the person that’s living with incontinence you know, should live a very dignified life. So as I’ve, you know, talked to numerous people over the 20 years, you know, patients, people at home, physicians, you mentioned nursing students, customers of ours and just interacted and talking about incontinence, I’ve just seen that there’s a real need for education and that, you know, like I said, it’s kind of my passion talking about it. 

Bruce Kassover: I love hearing when somebody is passionate about this field because it is the sort of thing that so many people are uncomfortable even talking or thinking about.

And, you know, the whole idea of educating people and getting them comfortable that this is something that they can discuss if they’re going to find the help that they need is really essential. So you decided to write a book. Can you tell us a little bit about that? 

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, I just wrote a book called Caring with Dignity, and I wrote it to really provide, you know, a resource for caregivers.

I think it’s a much needed resource. You know, incontinence can be overwhelming. It can be emotional, and I took that 20 years of, you know, incontinence and product experience and put it into a guide that’s easy for people to understand and read. It really doesn’t require any kind of medical background.

I made it super down to earth and user-friendly, and I just knew that there was a, a void for this type of education for someone that’s taking care of someone at home. You know, with incontinence. There’s millions of caregivers that are, that are struggling with this topic. 

Bruce Kassover: You know, I know that you, you have an emphasis on caregivers, but I’ve had a chance to, to, to really go through your book and first of all, I mean, I’m incredibly impressed by exactly what you’re saying about how down-to-earth and straightforward it is.

It really is an easy read for somebody who is not medically experienced. You know, you don’t, you, you did not have to go to med school or nursing school or anything like that to understand and, and get a lot of it a, a lot out of this book, but. I think that beyond just being for caregivers, the overview about incontinence, the types of incontinence, the products, the whole thing, it really seems to me like this has an audience beyond just caregivers, somebody who themselves is starting to experience symptoms can probably get an enormous amount out of this.

I’m wondering if you were sort of thinking about that as a secondary audience as well when you were putting this together. 

Michelle Mongillo: That’s a great point, and I believe I put in my introduction that, you know, the book would be great, you know, is intended for caregivers, but would also be great for someone that’s dealing with incontinence themselves.

And what we have found out since we launched the book, just even the beginning of October, that professional caregivers have found it useful as well. You know, as a nurse and even physicians, we don’t get, you know, nurses especially, we don’t get training on incontinence and I, that really hit me in the face when I was teaching nursing students; there is nothing in their curriculum that really talks about incontinence other than like the physiology of it. But, you know, coming out of nursing school and, you know, when you think of millions of people that have incontinence, most nurses are going to deal with that. So I think the book is a, is a good refresh for professionals and also they might be learning something new as well. So I think a wide audience on the book for sure. 

Bruce Kassover: One of the things you were mentioning, about, you know, the idea of education really sort of strikes me is that I think that a lot of people just don’t know – despite the fact that we live in our bodies our entire lives – we know we don’t go anywhere else.

A lot of us don’t know a lot about our bodies when things are going right, as well as when things are going wrong. I mean, the idea that people need to be educated about these things, just how your body works and what’s going on when things aren’t working right. You know, really seems to be something that’s very, very needed.

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, for sure. I mean, you know, I, I was just talking yesterday about the same subject and, you know, I feel like we should talk about incontinence like we do diabetes and hypertension and other diseases. You know, people don’t want to talk about incontinence and when there’s things happening and changes are happening, you’re right.

We need to be aware of that, and, you know, if they don’t want to talk to their healthcare provider about. Certainly don’t want to talk to their family members about it. So it does become kind of this hidden subject and one of my goals with the book is to bring that out in the forefront and let’s start talking about it.

Bruce Kassover: You are preaching to the choir because that is something that we are always talking about and desperately trying to do is normalize this conversation and get people to talk about it. But I do think that the specific focus that you try to put on the caregiver’s role is really particularly needed.

What is it about being a caregiver? What’s sort of special about being a caregiver for somebody with incontinence versus being a caregiver for somebody with a more easily discussed, a more readily understood disease. 

Michelle Mongillo: That’s a great question. You know, caregiving, you know, can happen to people overnight.

We call ’em instant caregivers. You know, you’re, if you’re taking, suddenly taking care of a parent or a sibling or a friend or maybe a child with special needs and you know, I talk to caregivers and they say, “Things are going okay, I’ve got everything managed,” and then they become incontinent. Whether it’s the person you know at home with dementia, an elderly parent, and I think what makes it difficult for a caregiver is incontinence is embarrassing. I can’t think of anything more undignified than having that happen, and then having to talk to someone about it, especially if it’s your, you know, your child that’s now taking care of you and your roles are reversed.

So I think it’s a super sensitive topic and, you know, it’s, it’s an undignified thing. And like I said, I’ll talk to caregivers that’ll say, “Oh, things are going good,” and then, “Oh my mom became incontinent.” And a lot of times what they’ll do is they’ll say, “Oh, now I can’t take care of them at home anymore.” My hope for the book too is that people will use this book and go, “You know what? I think I can handle this. I think I can manage this. I’m going to give it a try.” 

Bruce Kassover: That’s an important point because we know that incontinence is one of the most significant reasons why, older adults go into to homes and care facilities is because they just can’t be cared for, or their children are either unable or unwilling or uncomfortable caring for them.

And you really talked about an important word when you’re talking about dignity. How do you handle and maintain dignity, both as a caregiver for yourself and for your patient when you’re dealing with these sorts of issues? 

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, I think that it’s important to remember that the person you’re taking care of is just that, a person, and even though maybe they can’t communicate with you or they’re requiring your assistance with care, that you have to remember that their dignity needs to be preserved. And I think one way to do that is to talk about it when you’re taking care of someone that has incontinence, letting them know everything you’re about to do, what you’re going to do, why you’re going to do it. You know, being efficient and being ready when you’re helping someone change an incontinent product or you’re doing that for them, you know, is, is really, it’s a really intimate act of caring and I think just that, letting them know what you’re doing, communicating about it, not trying to hide it.

And, you know, your point about, the nursing home admissions, I’ve also worked in the long-term care world for, oh my gosh, 20 some years. Probably one of my favorite places that I worked. And, you know, I heard that over and over from family members. You know, “I just couldn’t handle this at home anymore.” So it really is a, you know, a life changing condition, can be.

Bruce Kassover: Now if you are somebody, you know, people will go into care facilities for a variety of reasons, not necessarily, you know, incontinence may be a compounding reason. If I’m somebody whose loved one is in or going into a facility, I mean, I have to be concerned about the caregivers there as well, that they are maintaining that same sort of sense of, of dignity also, what should I be looking out for, thinking about, talk, communicating with the facility to make sure that happens. 

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, that’s a, gosh, that’s a great question. I think that one of the things to do as a family member is to be there. And to be present when they’re providing care to your loved one to see how they’re doing it.

The other thing, if that’s not something that you know, a family member wants to do is ask them, how are you educated about this? What kind of training do you get, you know, long-term care is a great, great industry and they, they are all about education and you know, a lot of their education that they receive is related to dignity and comfort and respecting someone’s rights.

So, you know, I like to think that they do it right more than they don’t do it right. Just because I worked in that world for so long and I think that skilled nursing or senior living, you know, they get a bad rap sometimes. But again, I think it’s all about communicating. It’s about being present in, in the facility whenever you can be, and asking questions and being involved.

Bruce Kassover: Yeah, you’re right when you talk about the bad rap, but really it’s just, you know, one rare case and it sort of ignores the fact that every day there are millions and millions of people who are being cared for properly and caringly and, you know, it’s, it’s important to remember it’s worth it to be vigilant and concerned and careful, but you also have to understand the industry really is, like you’re saying, built around the idea of, of treating people well and with dignity.

But for those people who are caring for somebody at home, you know, you’re looking after a loved one and they have not yet developed incontinence or you, you’re not yet aware of incontinence, what sort of signs should you be looking for that things might be taking a turn that you weren’t expecting? You know, when, when it’s first developing. 

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, oftentimes you’ll see individuals that are trying to hide that. First of all, one of the reasons they’re hiding it is because they’re afraid, if “Oh, if my daughter knows this is happening, will I still be able to stay home?”

Like there’s that stigma and fear that, “Oh my gosh. If someone knows that I’m not going to be able to stay home, they’re not going to be able to handle it. I’m not going to tell anybody. It’s embarrassing and what’s going to happen to me.” But oftentimes we’ll see people, you could see an increase in laundry, because, first, they’re not using products because they’re afraid to talk about it and ask for products. You might see an increase in usage of feminine hygiene products. If there’s someone else living in the house, you know, like a teenager or, you know, a young female, they’ll, you know, the individual will use, you know, period pads and things like that. Increased towel usage or towels missing. We’ve even heard of people using rags, you know, just finding whatever they can to absorb the urine. Toilet paper, they’ll just wad a lot of toilet paper and, and trying to absorb, you know, the leakage. So there’s several things.

Also the person might start, start isolating, “No, I don’t want to go to church. No, I don’t want to go get my hair done. No, I’m not going to go to the family function.”

You know, I’d like to think that doesn’t happen a lot, but, but you know, in conversations I’ve had, it does happen. And that’s why I kind of covered that in the book. You know, people say, “Oh no, I’m not incontinent. But you know, but I do, you know, wet my pants.”

So we have to be careful about the language, too. How are we asking someone. Again, the more that comes out in the forefront, then, then we can start addressing it. 

Bruce Kassover: That’s interesting. You talk about how, “I’m not incontinent, but I do have leaks.” Because one is sort of like a label for yourself as a person – “I am incontinent” – versus, you know, “There’s something that happens to me.” And that distinction I think is really interesting and, and helping give them a way to discuss it without having to label themselves is really interesting.

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, I’ve literally had someone say that to me, you know, “I’m not incontinent, I just wear these pads because I leak.”

Sarah Jenkins: Yeah, that’s really unfortunate that, you know, it’s so stigmatized that people are so scared to discuss it and even to their loved ones. We have had several calls in the past, just even couple months with spouses, you know. Usually women who are really struggling with their husbands admitting that they have incontinence and, you know, what advice would you give to them if they just don’t want to talk about it? They might even admit that they have it, but they just do not want to recognize it. I know I had one woman say that she’s tried to get her husband to go to the doctor. She’s trying to at least get him to, you know, put some protective towels or things on the furniture and he just will not do it.

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah. That is really tough. And, you know, that breaks my heart because I think that happens a lot and you know. I would love whoever that person is. I’d love to just send them a copy of my book because I have stories weaved into there that are fictional, but based on conversations about starting that conversation with someone.

And I think men, you know, that is the hardest. My father had incontinence after prostate surgery. Fortunately my mother’s a nurse as well, so they were easily had the conversation, but for that particular situation, I guess what I would do is, you know, is to let that gentleman know it’s very common. You know, it’s not normal, but it’s common and that millions of people are dealing with this. He’s not the only one. And I would probably buy products. I’d probably buy like a male pad and put them in the bathroom for him and leave and just say, “These are here, and you know, I’m, I’m giving these to you because I love you and I want us to, you know, still have our life and do things, but we’re not going to be able to, you know, if you can’t, you know, if we can’t move past this.” I think oftentimes too, especially that case, he’s embarrassed, he doesn’t want to talk to his wife about it, right? He’s the man, he’s the guy, he’s the provider. I mean, there is that, you know, stereotype still, and I don’t know if that case, if he’d consider talking to someone else, right? Sometimes they’ll talk to someone else. Might not go to a healthcare provider, but might talk to someone on the phone. We have an e-nurse line that’s manned 24-7 by nurses. All they do is talk to people about incontinence, and it’s confidential and it’s on the phone so you don’t have to see anyone. Sarah, if you interact with them again, you could certainly send them our that number. 

Sarah Jenkins: Yeah, and we can put that in our show notes as well. 

Bruce Kassover: I think that that also brings up a sort of a broader point about, you know, you, you were talking earlier about how you sort of have to be a little bit of a detective if you’re a caregiver and sort of notice these things if the person you’re caring for isn’t really forthcoming. And say that you do start to notice these things and the person isn’t saying anything to you, how do you think you sort of initiate that conversation to say, you know, “Hey mom, I think that you might have an issue.” How do you go about that in a way that is dignified but also gets them to sort of open up? 

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah. I think it’s acknowledging it. I think it’s first acknowledging that, “You know, mom, I know this is embarrassing to you and I know that this is the last thing you want to talk to me about. But we really need to talk about it so that we can manage it so that you can be healthy and you can be safe.”

You know, people that are incontinent have a higher risk to fall because they’re rushing to the bathroom or they could slip in urine. And I worry about that for people that are hiding their incontinence.

You know, it’s not safe. It could be an issue. And I think too, it’s just as hard for the caregiver to initiate that conversation. So they just have to really be brave and think about it like any other medical condition, right? “You know, Mom, I need you to take your high blood pressure meds, or I need you to get this diabetes monitoring device so that we can see what’s going on. And you know what? I also want you to be open to wearing some pads to help with your incontinence so you can be safe and healthy and that you can stay here.” You know, I don’t think you want to threaten anyone, but you want to say, “You know, we’ve got to manage this together or we’re going to have, you know, a cascade of issues that could happen. 

Bruce Kassover: That makes a lot of sense. That sounds like a sound approach as long as you just get a little bit of courage to be able to step forward. You know, we’ve been talking about the physical side of things. You know, you’re noticing leaks or pads or you know, those sorts of things.

But the emotional side is every bit as challenging, and I’m wondering if maybe you could talk about, first of all, the things that a caregiver should be looking for in terms of the mental health of the person they’re caring for, but then maybe also how a caregiver handles his or her own mental health when dealing with these issues.

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, that’s a great point. You know, caregiver burnout is real. Most caregivers are juggling their job. They might be caring for their children and they might be caring for a parent. And there’s so many resources out there for caregivers. You know, we’re partners with Caregiver Action Network and actually November is National Caregiver Month.

They’re a great resource. So I think my advice to the caregiver was, you’ve got to take care of yourself too. You know, caregiver burnout is real and you’re not alone. Don’t try and do it alone. You know, I recently had, you know, an issue with my mother who fell, who lives independently, she’s 91, very independent. She fell. Bam. Overnight I became an instant caregiver and, you know, I had to accept help, and I’m the nurse and I had to have other people help me. And that made a huge difference for me to be able to focus on things like I’m doing today because someone else is helping her today.

So that would be my message to the caregiver.

And I think I mentioned that, you know, it’s not uncommon for someone with incontinence to isolate. They don’t want to go anywhere. They’re terrified they’re going to have an accident. So I think as a caregiver, you have to be in tune to that and you have to help them with that and let, and you have to get the right product for them, the right toileting schedule for them. You have to educate yourself so that you can help mitigate them having any kind of accident or leakage, you know, while they’re trying to do something social perhaps.

But I think as a caregiver, you know, that’s such a good point. It’s not just the phy physical aspect, but you know, trying to get the person to talk to you about it and saying, you know, “I notice you don’t want to go anywhere anymore. I notice you’re staying in your room. Can we please talk about that? You know, I want to be part of your life and I’m worried about you.” Because people can go into depression over that for sure. 

Bruce Kassover: You know, we’re talking about people who you can interact with, in a very direct way. You know, what’s going on, what are the issues, and, and have those sorts of conversations.

But of course, we also know that, especially in an older population, we have people who are going through various degrees of cognitive decline, and when you have somebody who has dementia, particularly more advanced dementia, that communication might not be as easy to have. What are your suggestions for people who are dealing with people who might have cognitive issues as well as incontinence?

Michelle Mongillo: I’ve talked to a lot of people about this, both caregivers and both professional caregivers, and people that are taking care of someone at home with dementia, they do great. The minute that dementia person becomes incontinent, they don’t think they can handle it.

The same with professional caregivers. They will, you know, think that someone with dementia is not capable of toileting and it’s really, you know, just the opposite. And I’m going to get a little, you know, not graphic, but when you think about it, since we all were toddlers, we have been going to the bathroom. We have been pulling our pants down, we’ve been pulling our pants up. And in my past experience in long-term care, we were very successful on dementia care units with keeping dementia patients, residents continent, or minimizing their episodes of incontinence by toileting them, by showing them a picture of a toilet if they’re nonverbal.

Showing them a picture of the toilet, “Come with me.” Very simple. Two to three words. And it can be very successful. Now, I also know there’s people with cognitive issues and they may be combative or they may just not be, you know, mobility wise, able to do that. But I like people to take away that just because someone has impaired cognition, whether it’s dementia or a brain injury or whatever it might be, that cognitive issue doesn’t mean that you can’t be successful with them toileting.

And maybe they’re still using an incontinence product and toileting. But you know, I always say if someone’s incontinence six times a day and you get that down to three times, you’re a hero. You know, that’s 50%. So, you know, I think, being very sensitive to the dementia person and not just assuming they don’t know what to do, because it’s a very normal thing we’ve done our whole life.

Bruce Kassover: That makes perfect sense. Now a lot of what we’re talking about when we’re talking about being a caregiver for people with incontinence are people in the older population, which makes sense. You know, you have have people who are, you know, as, as people get older, they do need more, you know, help and, and caregiving, but there is a population of people who have neurological diseases or conditions who have, you know, physical issues who are not necessarily elderly, who are not necessarily, you know, mentally impacted as well, but who do also have continence issues and need caregiving. Are there differences in the way caregivers treat them that we should be aware of or thinking about? Or is there a sort of different set of approaches or circumstances that these caregivers should be thinking of? 

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah. You know, I talk about that in the book as well, is that incontinence affects people throughout their lifespan.

It’s not just as we age. I have a section that talks about children with you know, youth with developmental disabilities or children that are past that potty training stage and are having nighttime incontinence. You know, women that have had lots of children might be having some incontinence.

So as a caregiver, yeah, your approach is definitely going to be different, I think. The products are definitely going to be different and the conversation that you have with a, you know, someone that’s a preteen, you know, that doesn’t have a, a cognitive impairment, but has a physical impairment, you know, is very different. That’s really, really hard.

And we talk about that in the book. I put a story in there about, you know, I interviewed a mom about her child that she’s taking care of at home and you know, gosh, I got off the phone and thought I never have anything to complain about in my life. You know, talk about a hero, superhero, what she’s doing.

So, yeah, it’s, it’s very different when you throw in, some kind of, you know, comorbidity like that, like some other kind of disease. And, you know, we have to remember too, just because someone can’t go to the toilet doesn’t mean there aren’t other ways for them to go to the bathroom. You know, they can use a bed pan, they can use a bedside commode. They can be wheeled into the bathroom. It’s not just, oh, let’s walk into the bathroom. I think we need to remember that, too, that we sometimes need to bring the devices to them because of their physical impairments. 

Bruce Kassover: That is a very good point. And you know, I wish that, well, I certainly recommend people who are, especially in situations like we’re talking about, do go and take a look at your book because there is just far too much information in here for us to ever hope to discuss on one podcast, you cover enormous amount of stuff.

You spend a good amount of time also, and something you just mentioned about choosing products because, you know, that’s something that caregivers, especially caregivers who are new to the role don’t really have a lot of familiarity with, you know, how, what is a good product, what is an appropriate product, what should I be looking for?

Can you give us any sort of, you know, just quick guidance on product choice, and what caregivers should be thinking about? 

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, it’s a good question as well. You know, incontinence products can be overwhelming and they can be confusing. I actually have a section in the book or a page that talks about the packaging of incontinence products.

When you go to buy incontinence products, it can be, you know, very overwhelming. So I talk about that. What does this mean on the package? You know, and it’s, I always say, if you’re just starting out to buy incontinence products, you have to look at, of course, what size they should be based on your body type, but what’s the person’s mobility? Are they laying in a bed all day? Are they able to walk with a walker? Are they able to get to the toilet? Are they in a wheelchair all day? What is their issue? What’s their mobility level? Because you want to give them a product that promotes the most independence. Not dependence. We want people to be wearing products that are form fitting and garment like is what I would say to look for in a product, not something that’s big and bulky.

You know, a lot of, most times these are replacing someone’s underwear. Sarah, to go back to that gentleman you were talking about, you know, there are gender specific products. There’s products designed for men that are very discreet and no one would know that they’re wearing them, and I don’t think people understand that.

So, you know, I’m fortunate that I work for a company for the last 20 years that understands that there has to be a clinical voice when it comes to making a product, and that it is all about putting that patient in the center of the development of the product. So I think, you know, to kind of summarize that, it’s finding the right product based on your level of leakage and your mobility, and then making sure it’s a quality product.

You know, cheaper is not better. And that applies to incontinence products as well. You buy something that costs less, you’re just going to use more of it. It’s the 1-ply toilet paper versus the 2- or 3-ply. You’re just going to go through more of it.

So making sure you’re getting a good quality product. I think that you need to make sure the manufacturer supports the product. You know, all of the products that we make under the Prevail name, have an 800 number on it that you can call for support, and that’s our e-nurse team to actually talk to a nurse about your products. You know, people want to talk to nurses; they’ll talk to a nurse before they will someone else about their issues.

So, you know, I wouldn’t take, you know, buying an incontinent product, you know, pun intended, I guess, ‘lightly.’ Really, you know, do your research, and my book gives really some great guidance on it as well.

Sarah Jenkins: I think it’s a great point, Michelle, that you can actually call someone to talk to them about this.

I think so many people go to a big box store, they see what’s on the shelves. It’s very confusing. As you said, everybody’s using different terminology. It’s really hard to kind of decipher what you need. You know, especially when you’re just starting out. So having that ability to call and talk to someone who is intimately familiar with the product and can ask you questions about, you know, what your loved one is dealing with and the different types of leaks and when they’re leaking and their lifestyle and mobility.

I think that’s just such a huge help for consumers and a lot of people don’t know that that’s available. So, that’s really great. 

Bruce Kassover: In fact, Michelle, maybe you could tell us a little bit more about First Quality, because this may be, the first time that some of our listeners have heard the name. And maybe you could tell us a little bit about in more detail about what the company does, what it offers, and how it might be of benefit to them.

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, First Quality has been in business a little over 30 years, and they manufacture, you know, we’re known for manufacturing high quality incontinence products. We really want people to feel confident and secure in our products. So we make them under the Prevail name, and Prevail can be purchased on Amazon and other avenues, but I think it’s important to know that where you’re getting your products from are from a manufacturer that’s making products in the United States, that it’s supported by engineers and clinical people that really understand, you know, the purpose of the product and how it should be worn, and how it should absorb and that we’re involved in partnerships, First Quality has been involved with NAFC for many years and, you know, all of my work through First Quality with education in different universities is because of them promoting it. The book that I wrote, Caring With Dignity, is because of First Quality. They’re very different – we’re very different than other manufacturers because we invest in our consumers and the people that are wearing our products, the caregivers. We have a great partnership, I think I mentioned with Caregiver Action Network because we understand that caregivers are the ones using our products as well.

So, again, I’m really fortunate as a clinician that I’ve worked for a company that understands about quality products and what goes into it and the whole education drive behind it. 

Bruce Kassover: That’s great. That’s really good to hear. But now about your book, if I wanted to get a copy of it, how would I get my hands on one?

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, you could go on Amazon to get the book. Barnes and Noble. Other major retailers like walmart.com as well. And you can also go on, Mascot Book Publishing is where the book was published directly as well. 

Bruce Kassover: Excellent. Yeah. I can say for anybody who’s, interested, it’s not an enormous book. I’m taking a look at it right now, we’re a little over a hundred pages, but it is incredibly, clearly written. It is directed at the patient and the caregiver level, so it’s very easy to understand from a readability perspective, I mean, everything about it is… not only are the, like you said, the anecdotes you have good, there are really great, very clear illustrations of, you know, things like the anatomy, so you understand what’s going on. There are, you know, illustrations of products so you can understand how they’re put together and what to look for. There are, you know, very simple charts and diaries and, and trackers and things like that.

It’s just a remarkably useful all-in-one book, even down to things like the typography is just, it’s very easy to read. It’s large enough so that people can, you know, it’s not a large type book, but it’s certainly large enough that it’s not, not a challenge to read… everything about it.

I really think that you and the team that put it together, you know, from, from a visual and and graphic perspective, just did an awesome job with this. You should be really proud and I hope that people get as much benefit as they imagine they will out of it. 

Michelle Mongillo: Thank you. I appreciate that. And it, and it was a huge team effort. I did not create this in a vacuum. I provided the content, but it was a really big team at First Quality that brought this book to life. And one of the things I quickly want to mention is I have a section in there, you know, I interviewed, . A physician assistant who specializes in urology and gynecology, and she was telling me that if people would come, when they come to visit her with a new onset of incontinence, if they would bring the following information to her, she said, I could just so much better treat them.

So, you know, she and I talked about that and I put that in the book and it, you could literally rip that page out of the book if you wanted to. But it’s things to know before you go as a caregiver, you’re taking your loved one to their appointment, or it’s you going to your appointment that might be incontinent.

Have this information ready to give to the person that you’re going to talk to about your incontinence. It will. It will help with your treatment plan. It will save time. You know, we all know in healthcare, you know, practitioners are seeing a lot of people every day and it’s just, they just kind of, you know, 15 minutes, 15 minutes or whatever the time may be. So, you know, I think, you know, we need to advocate for ourselves. We need to advocate for the person we’re taking care of and be as prepared as possible when we talk to a healthcare provider, whether it’s a physician, a PA, or a nurse practitioner, whoever that person might be. You know, it’s our responsibility to give them as much information as possible so we can get the best treatment either for ourselves or for the person we’re taking care of. 

Bruce Kassover: I couldn’t agree more and I hope that people definitely take advantage of everything that this book offers and really put it to good use to live like the title says, to care with dignity and to help their loved ones, and if it’s for people themselves, also to live with dignity.

Now, as you know though, this is Life Without Leaks. And one of the things we always like to ask our guests before we leave is to see if they have one little hint, tip, strategy, bit of advice that they could share with our listeners so they can live a life without leaks. So I’d like to ask you if you might have one for us today.

Michelle Mongillo: Yeah, I would say that you’re not alone. You’re not alone. This is common. There are so many resources and you can live a very fulfilling life and manage incontinence. 

Bruce Kassover: Well, Michelle, that is encouraging and I hope that people take what you’re saying to heart. So thank you so much for joining us today, for sharing with us everything that you’ve had and also for putting out this book that I think is going to make a real incredible difference for a lot of people. So thank you. 

Michelle Mongillo: Thank you so much for having me. It was really a lot of fun. 

Bruce Kassover: Life Without Leaks has been brought to you by the National Association for Continence. Our music is Rainbows by Kevin McLeod. More information about NAFC is available online at nafc.org.